Re: Dead Battery - Star Motorcycle Forums: Star Raider, V-Max, V-Star, Road-Star Forum
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post #1 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 06:23 PM Thread Starter
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Re: Dead Battery

In one of my "senior moments", last fall as I was putting my bike away for the winter, I somehow forgot to turn the key off, and completely drained the battery. Then I discovered that if a battery is drained right down to zero, it cannot be re-charged using my Battery Tender Junior. So my question is... is this battery now toast? (it is just 2 years old) Or will the neighborhood garage be able to charge it back up? Or is it impossible to save it after it has gone completely flat and stayed that way for several months?

Thanks,
Glen
Focus On Newfoundland

2014 YAMAHA V-STAR CUSTOM
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post #2 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 06:48 PM
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With the right charger you may be able to bring it back to life to some degree and it'll probably work well enough to get your bike started throughout this season but it just may put an unnecessary strain on your charging system so IMO you may as well just get a new one.

The way I see it, once it's dead there's no resurrecting it fully and who wants a zombie battery?
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post #3 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 07:10 PM
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lead acid batteries need to be recharged immediately after they are discharged.

That is why they work so well in cars, they can sit for weeks or a few months and hold their energy, then you whack them down with 500A for several seconds to start the engine, and the alternator recharges them immediately.

Car and motorcycle batteries are designed with their chemistry optimized for that type of usage. Unfortunately one of the tradeoffs is if the battery is discharged and left for days or weeks without being recharged, there is a layer that forms on the lead plates, and its not reversible.

Dio is correct, you might be able to get some life back out of it, if its put on a bigger charger - like 10A maybe, for a couple hours, but it will not be rigth, In fact I would be surprised if it was able to spin the starter. You might be able to charge it up and push start the bike till you get a new one.

I got my last 650 battery online for about $25, with free shipping. That was 3 years ago now and the bike still starts on the first revolution of the crankshaft. That's less than it costs to fill the gas tank on your car - just get a new one, the first time you are not left stranded somewhere it will be worth it.

BTW, if you ever need a battery that you will keep charged and use for emergency lighting, or if you have a solar panel on your roof that runs a light in the house, don't get a car battery or a motorcycle battery, get a deep cycle battery like they use on boats for lighting overnight, or a UPS battery like they use to backup computer systems. Instead of being designed to surge out 500A for a few minutes, they are designed to supply a steady 10 or 20A for a few hours. But then you still have to recharge those within a day or so.
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Last edited by KCW; 04-17-2018 at 07:13 PM.
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post #4 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 07:32 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks guys, just ordered a new battery from FortNine.ca. Should have it here by next week. Not cheap, but it has good reviews, and has free shipping to our remote island in the North Atlantic. It says that I am "responsible for activating and charging the battery". Does this mean it doesn't come already charged?

https://fortnine.ca/en/parts-unlimited-agm-battery

Glen
Focus On Newfoundland

2014 YAMAHA V-STAR CUSTOM
MC Enterprises engine guard
Big Bike Parts chrome solo rack
"Clevver" clutch lever
clutch adjustment kit
SupaBrake III brake light modulator
Cortech Super 2.0 (24 litre) tail bag
clock/thermometer set
QDC harness/USB phone charger
Furygan leather gloves
Xelement leather jacket
NexGen riding boots
HJC CL-17 Redline helmet/Pinlock insert
Oxford paddock stands
Nelson-Rigg deluxe cover
Battery Tender Junior
cable lock
Helmet Hooker

2014 HONDA CB500FA

Last edited by camperbc; 04-17-2018 at 07:35 PM.
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post #5 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 07:46 PM
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sometimes they are shipped with the acid in a plastic bottle, that you pour into the 6 cells through the caps

that's only possible if its not a sealed battery - it might just be standard wording, like everything you buy at harbor freight says "always wear safety glasses when using this product" - even volt meters and calipers and pliers...

If you picked a battery from a 'what bike do you have' selection I think Vstars all use sealed batteries.
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post #6 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 08:09 PM Thread Starter
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Quote:
Originally Posted by KCW View Post
sometimes they are shipped with the acid in a plastic bottle, that you pour into the 6 cells through the caps
that's only possible if its not a sealed battery - it might just be standard wording, like everything you buy at harbor freight says "always wear safety glasses when using this product" - even volt meters and calipers and pliers... If you picked a battery from a 'what bike do you have' selection I think Vstars all use sealed batteries.
The listing says: "Special absorbed-glass mat battery eliminates water loss, permitting the battery to be permanently sealed once it is filled with acid", whatever that means. Anyway, it is for this particular model of bike, so hoping all goes well! Sorry for not being very mechanically inclined, but as I must add the acid myself, doesn't this mean that it has zero charge when it arrives? If this is so, can I assume that my Battery Tender Junior still won't be able to charge it?

Glen
Focus On Newfoundland

2014 YAMAHA V-STAR CUSTOM
MC Enterprises engine guard
Big Bike Parts chrome solo rack
"Clevver" clutch lever
clutch adjustment kit
SupaBrake III brake light modulator
Cortech Super 2.0 (24 litre) tail bag
clock/thermometer set
QDC harness/USB phone charger
Furygan leather gloves
Xelement leather jacket
NexGen riding boots
HJC CL-17 Redline helmet/Pinlock insert
Oxford paddock stands
Nelson-Rigg deluxe cover
Battery Tender Junior
cable lock
Helmet Hooker

2014 HONDA CB500FA
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post #7 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 08:30 PM
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the battery I got is a matt glass sealed battery, and they come fully charged.

The batteries that you buy with the acid in a separate bottle, when you pour it in that is the fully charged state: pure acid and pure lead plates.

I really don't know what they mean by activating the battery if its sealed - it will be fully charged when you get it, just like buying a car battery off the rack at Walmart (they fill the car batteries for you so you don't have to handle a bottle of sulfuric acid).

To quote Sir Paul McCartney, "it will be fine.. nothing to worry about.. its fine".

found this online:

Activating a Battery
Yuasa batteries come from the factory in one of two ways: Factory Activated (FA) where the battery is filled with electrolyte, sealed and charged at the factory. These batteries must be used within a period of time and cannot be stored indefinitely. The other type of battery is shipped dry and can be either a Conventional or AGM type of battery. These batteries are sometimes referred to as Bottle Supplied (BS) because they are shipped with the electrolyte stored in a plastic container. The battery is filled with electrolyte from the container when it’s ready to be activated. Once it’s unsealed, a battery should be activated, charged and installed. The plates of an unsealed battery will begin to oxidize making it more difficult to charge later.


If it is a sealed battery and it comes with a bottle of acid, maybe there is one port you open to fill with acid, and then it is glued shut again? I'm pretty sure you do not need to charge it after you put the acid in.

Last edited by KCW; 04-17-2018 at 08:34 PM.
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post #8 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 08:32 PM
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The acid and the lead is what makes the charge.
When you discharge it, you removed the acid and turned it more into water.

It won't be fully charged, but it should have 8-10v and will be fine, you normally leave it on the tender for a few hours or a day, they differ sometimes.

I believe with AGM you put the acid in it, wait a few hours for the acid to absorb (or you will kill the battery), then charge it for 12-24hours.

It is sealed, once you put the plastic cover on it, it seals the holes you put the acid in, as apposed to one that have vents and you maintain the level by refilling it every so often.
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post #9 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 09:09 PM
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i won't buy a battery if i can't find the the cca numbers for it. i have seen batteries for the 650 that have 130 cca that cost close to a yusa that has 210 cca. the more cca's the battery can deliver the quicker the engine will start with a lot less work for the alternator to bring it back up. i can,t find the cca requirement for a 650 but i would never put a 130 cca battery in mine, right now the yusa is on it's 4th year a tests just slightly less than when new, i might get a lithium 270 cca for the next one, if i have the money. i would rather spend on a good battery now than have to replace a stator&regulator later because they got over worked from using a cheap low capacity battery, if your old battery didn't freeze and the plates aren't sulfated it will come back and be usable but for how long is anybodys guess

Last edited by pauli466; 04-17-2018 at 09:12 PM.
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post #10 of 16 (permalink) Old 04-17-2018, 09:22 PM Thread Starter
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Thank-you kindly, KCW, and also to the others who chimed in while I was still writing this. I will let you all know how I make out once it arrives. Gotta say, I'm getting pretty excited to soon be back out on two wheels for the first time since last October! Two pretty-new bikes just sitting here in my porch begging to be ridden! We still have some patchy snow here and there, but it's bare for the most part... just waiting for the temps to climb a little, then off I go!

I have to get the need-for-speed out of my system before July though, as our daughter is coming back home to visit for a few weeks... and... well, with her being a cop and all... it might be a bit embarrassing to get charged with speeding by my own flesh and blood! But hey, last time she was here I took her out for some fun in the convertible at 175+ km/h and she was all smiles, so I probably have nothing to fear!

Glen
Focus On Newfoundland

2014 YAMAHA V-STAR CUSTOM
MC Enterprises engine guard
Big Bike Parts chrome solo rack
"Clevver" clutch lever
clutch adjustment kit
SupaBrake III brake light modulator
Cortech Super 2.0 (24 litre) tail bag
clock/thermometer set
QDC harness/USB phone charger
Furygan leather gloves
Xelement leather jacket
NexGen riding boots
HJC CL-17 Redline helmet/Pinlock insert
Oxford paddock stands
Nelson-Rigg deluxe cover
Battery Tender Junior
cable lock
Helmet Hooker

2014 HONDA CB500FA

Last edited by camperbc; 04-17-2018 at 09:25 PM.
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