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Discussion Starter #1 (Edited)
So I took my rear off wheel to change the tire and lube the splines and I',m at a loss figuring out the torque specs and assembly procedure. The manual says torque the axle than the 4 bolts that hold the final drive to the swingarm. The service manual says to do the opposite.

Sooooo, My questions are this
Which procedure do I follow.
What are the torque specs for the final drive on swingarm? The same manual says 70ft, 43ft, and 67ft.
What are the torque specs for the bell housing (four bolts on the final drive shaft, I took it apart to lube the joining collar)
What are the torque specs for the axle?

Thanks in advance.

BTW The splines looked fantastic but they were lubed with a white grease and not the M77 honda moly paste.

The four bolts in question are the second and third pics of this ventures page:
http://www.venturers.org/Tech_Library/?action=article&cat_id=001006&id=383
 

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what manual are you reading that has multiple choice torque specs for the final drive?

I think the Vstar 650 shop manual is available online (somehow its gone public domain?). I had a copy on a CD and when i could not find it I looked online and it was right there.

My copy of the Vstar_650_service_manual says:

Rear wheel axle nut: 70.2 ft-lbs

In the service manual you have to look at the exploded drawings of the parts, and use the same names for the bolt or nut from the drawings to look up the value in the torque table.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
The service manual is confusing as it lists different specs with same names. I figured someone on this forum has removed the back wheel at one point in time. Maybe not.
 

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Looked at the service manual and see there are 4 splines on the drive shaft that need to be lubed.

Sorry I cant be more help. If there is any doubt in the service manual I always go by the torque table. You are wise to be careful torquing into aluminum housings. In general if you snug the bolt or nut up, and give it a bit more till it feels like its loaded up, you will be close to the torque spec. If there is any doubt go with the lower torque value and then see how it feels.

I know this sounds sketchy, developing a feel for the hardware is something that takes a bit of experience, and you kinda have to strip a few threads till you learn when you have gone too far.
 

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Discussion Starter #5 (Edited)
KCW Thanks for looking into this for me.

I think I got it. In my illustration below (pardon my lack of skills) I have red dots on the parts in question. For part 41(nut) I have 30ftlbs for the others that go through the swingarm I have 50ftlbs. Just seems like a little much into aluminum. I may try just snugging them down and see where my torque wrench clicks.


Looks like my attachment did not come out well.
 

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I usually just leave the torque wrench in my toolbox to be used in critical situations where it matters, like interanl engine and transmission components. I've had the rear wheel off and back on my 1100 over 100 tiumes in the 10 years I've owned it....if not more. Never used a torque wrench on any of the bolts in that area and have never had an issue .....and have almost 50,000 miles on it.

The rule of thumb is 0-30 ft lbs = use 1/4" drive socket to tighten. 30-60 ft lbs is pretty tight use 3/8" drive. 60 and above use 1/2" drive. The type of material is also critical, but the torque spec usually reflects that. You could also be off 20-30% and be OK in most situations. I could bet that if you had 2 torque wrenches there would be a minimum of 10% difference in values between the 2. Most I've seen can vary up to 30%..... especially a wrench that cost less then $250-$300. Also, torque can change as the bolts get tightened and loosened several times.

Just get it close and go ride.....you need to recheck everything after a few hundred miles anyway.
 

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Discussion Starter #7
Success!

Torqued the first housing cover nut to 30ftlbs. Did the second one by feel and tested it with my snap-on torque wrench and it was pretty close. Had someone tighten the axle nut while I pushed for dear life on the wheel to make sure it was going to stay and the axle was not going to walk. Had 4mm on the 9 o clock position and 2mm on the 3 o clock. Not good enough so I took the wheel off and re tightened the housing cover while holding it out out a little further away from the bike. (hard to explain but it has a slight movement when not locked down) BINGO even gap all around.
 

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So I took my rear off wheel to change the tire and lube the splines and I',m at a loss figuring out the torque specs and assembly procedure. The manual says torque the axle than the 4 bolts that hold the final drive to the swingarm. The service manual says to do the opposite.

Sooooo, My questions are this
Which procedure do I follow.
What are the torque specs for the final drive on swingarm? The same manual says 70ft, 43ft, and 67ft.
What are the torque specs for the bell housing (four bolts on the final drive shaft, I took it apart to lube the joining collar)
What are the torque specs for the axle?

Thanks in advance.

BTW The splines looked fantastic but they were lubed with a white grease and not the M77 honda moly paste.

The four bolts in question are the second and third pics of this ventures page:
The Venturers - Yamaha Venture Technical Support Library
the M77 honda stuff isn't even close to the honda moly 60 paste that isn't made anymore, the 60 paste was 60% moly the M77 paste is only 15% moly so most people are switching to loctite moly paste with 65% moly what is more important than torque secs and the torquing sequence is getting the gap even between the drive and the wheel hub, i leave the axle for last so i can tap the wheel to get the gap even, the driveshaft housing is fixed to the frame, the wheel will move to change the gap. i'v seen some with shims between the housing and frame, i guess the housings aren't all perfectly made
 

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I'm with you......I went with the Loctite stuff when my Moly 60 ran out.
 

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I took my final drive apart (2004 Classic) to lube the splines. They all looked good, lubed ‘em up, but can’t seem to get the gap right. I am encouraged to read the idea of tapping the wheel while tightening to adjust the gap. I don’t really want to use shims if I can avoid it. I’ve had the assemby off the bike to change the tore and it went back on fine that time.

It’s making a groaning sound when I rotate the wheel. I’m assuming that is the splines out of alignment (ie the gap is uneven). I’ll try the wheel tap while tightening.

I am measuring the gap with a digital caliper. What sort of tolerance should the gap be within?

Thanks,

Joshua


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Instead of measuring the gap,I bolt the housing to the swingarm with the axle in ,no wheel, then put a square on the axle. I measure to the machined part of the housing. I found to be perfect, I need .018" shims on the top bolts and the axle is 1/16" back from the end of the slot in the swingarm. On my old '99' I had to use a couple of THICK washers to get it aligned correctly. I tack welded them on so it wasn't a pain come tire changing time.
 

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I am encouraged to read the idea of tapping the wheel while tightening to adjust the gap. I don’t really want to use shims if I can avoid it.
are you talking about your 650 classic?

when you take the back wheel off there are no shims on the 650. Unless you pulled the pinion gear and final drive gear apart the assembly should just go back together.

Snug up the 4 bolts on the left rear fork and it aligns the final drive with the fork/swing arm - snug up the axle and make sure nothing is pushing the wheel to the left or right when you tighten it down. The tire should be centered between the rear fork on the swing axle assembly.

the vstar 650 service manual is available online in pdf format.
 

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once i got so aggravated trying to line up that gap that i put 4 shims i made by taping two quarters together in the gap and then just snugged the bolts then pulled the shims out with a vice grips and finished tightening the unit up, the reason its gets out of alignment is because the rear wheel is cocking in the frame as your tightening down. the drive can,t move much at all but the axle can, basically the drive won't adjust but the wheel will, one of these time i going to try to put a ratchet strap around the back of the rear tire to hold it forward against the stops, then i'll know for sure the wheel is straight and that will tell me if permanent shims are really needed behind the drive. if someone could hold the tire forward while you tighten down that might work too.
 

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Instead of measuring the gap,I bolt the housing to the swingarm with the axle in ,no wheel, then put a square on the axle. I measure to the machined part of the housing. I found to be perfect, I need .018" shims on the top bolts and the axle is 1/16" back from the end of the slot in the swingarm. On my old '99' I had to use a couple of THICK washers to get it aligned correctly. I tack welded them on so it wasn't a pain come tire changing time.
how could you tell if axle was back equally 1/16 on each slot
 

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how could you tell if axle was back equally 1/16 on each slot
Just on the right side, I assemble everything except the washer and nut , move the axle back 1/16" slide the washer on, mark it, then tighten the nut making sure the axle and washer don't move.
 

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My 650s wheel/drive unit didn't have shims when I removed it, therefore it didn't need any going back in. Alignment is simple if you jiggle the wheel while snugging the four mounting bolts and axle nut by hand.
 

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I don't see where shimming is a good idea. If it comes apart without shims, it doesn't need them.
I have been through this. Pushing or forcing the tire forward, side to side, etc does nothing because there is not any slop in the 4 holes that the final drive bolts to in the swing arm. Not enough to make any difference. Its more of a psychological thing thinking you are getting some sort of adjustment movement.
Just put it together and quit obsessing over the gap.
 

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Yamaha had a problem with the early 650's . When they welded the swingarm the right side would warp out at the top throwing the final drive out of alignment and causing excess wear on the splines .On my "99" it was so bad you could look at the bike from the rear and see the final drive kicked out at the top. Quality control??? There have been several spline failures documented on this site, from 5 years back. Yamaha fixed this in about 2000-2001. However it doesn't hurt to check your bikes gaps just to make sure there are no problems. Go to 650 cc&d and look up final drive alignment. Before I bought my "99" I looked up Known Problems with a 650 and the final drive alignment problem came up. Yes I would say don't obsess over it ,but at least check it!
 

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I don't see where shimming is a good idea. If it comes apart without shims, it doesn't need them.
I have been through this. Pushing or forcing the tire forward, side to side, etc does nothing because there is not any slop in the 4 holes that the final drive bolts to in the swing arm. Not enough to make any difference. Its more of a psychological thing thinking you are getting some sort of adjustment movement.
Just put it together and quit obsessing over the gap.
moving the wheel left or right will change the gap, the gap doesn't have to be perfect but it needs to be close to even or it will make a creaking noise from the splines being misaligned, i wouldn't ride mine like that because i couldn't afford the 800.00 for a new drive when it fails
 

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moving the wheel left or right will change the gap, the gap doesn't have to be perfect but it needs to be close to even or it will make a creaking noise from the splines being misaligned, i wouldn't ride mine like that because i couldn't afford the 800.00 for a new drive when it fails


Kinda my thought. It’s making the noise, which is frustrating the heck outta me.


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