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Discussion Starter #1
Dear All,

I have read through the service manual, and my understanding of the information there is that the built in FI system has the sensors to cope with any minor changes to Air/fuel ratio (due to for example changing the slipon, or the famous Airbox mod).

Indeed the onboard FI system should report any out of range parameters coming from the O2 sensor, the intake air pressure sensor and the air temperature sensor...as well as the ISC valve (which compensates for fuel/air ratio when idling)..

So, in theory, if I do the mods, and the FI system does not complain in any way, this means that I am ok, and I do not need the aftermarket fuel controllers to protect the engine from harm...

Of course if I want to change the mapping to an air/fuel ratio to one with particular characteristics, then that is another issue....

Is my understanding correct?

R.
 

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From what I am reading, I have not tested my bike with a wideband yet, they run the bikes very lean. I am looking to get a programmer for my bike that I can adjust to take care of this problem. Start doing some research on what will work best for you. I would recommend finding a shop that can custom tune your bike for you. I do not like mail order tunes because every vehicle is different even if they come off the assembly line back to back.
 

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Discussion Starter #3
Agreed....

I am aware of the lean mapping from the factory - doubtless due to emissions regulations :(

I was enquiring more about the ability of the ecu to cope with the modifications, and whether any other owners have seen any error messages returned after the modifications of any sort.... (and of course whether I understood the service manual correctly :))

R.
 

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Agreed....

I am aware of the lean mapping from the factory - doubtless due to emissions regulations :(

I was enquiring more about the ability of the ecu to cope with the modifications, and whether any other owners have seen any error messages returned after the modifications of any sort.... (and of course whether I understood the service manual correctly :))

R.
Sorry I misunderstood what you wanted. The programmer if its in line will "lie" to the computer to get the output from the fuel injection system. On a "cage" we use a programmer that you plug in the OBD port and actually change the parameters on the computer. The computer can compensate about 15% fuel either way. So if you add a high flow air intake on the bike it could cause it to run too lean and the computer cannot compensate. Hope this helps some. Basically if you are going to do any mods I would HIGHLY recommend a tuner for the bike. Depending on the mods it might be required for it to run well without doing any damage. Since I just got my bike I do not know which one I will get. I just started researching it. There are a couple that "self program" but not sure what that will do. I want one I can plug my laptop into and set up what I want it to do, of find someone in my area that does professional reflashing of my bikes ECU.
 

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The ECU can cope a little, but the ECU only measures airflow up to 15% throttle, the rest is calculated buy the stock intake setup. As others said the O2 is narrow band it only fine tunes the mixture at idle and cruise and nowhere else.

So yes for best performance and engine cooling a tuner is recommended. also you might want to check out this. I have done it and countless others have too and it is the real deal!

Ivan's Performance Products
 

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you can do an airbox mod and not need a tuner. you would probably be fine changing your pipes to a slip-on muffler as well. that would not be significantly adding more air to your bike. but as someone else noted, your bike is already on a lean air/fuel mixture from the factory and the ECU can only account for minor changes like altitude. if you were to replace your air intake with just about any aftermarket one, you would definitely want to get a tuner to compensate additional fuel for the extra air you're introducing to the engine. i would suggest getting a tuner no matter what you do because the bike will run better with one regardless of what mods you decide to do.
 

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Discussion Starter #8
thanks for the advice...

which fuel tuner would you recommend to someone on a budget :)...I have looked at the cobra FI200r and I know there are 2 versions (one without o2 sensor input and one with o2 sensor input)...which would you recommend?

R.
 

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thanks for the advice...

which fuel tuner would you recommend to someone on a budget
...I have looked at the cobra FI200r and I know there are 2 versions (one without o2 sensor input and one with o2 sensor input)...which would you recommend?

R.
You will pay as much for a tuner as the flash and you will only fix 5% of the problems. With the flash you fix 95% of all the problems the bike has
 

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i have the cobra fi2000R O2 model, and it seems to be a popular one. it supposedly gives a more precise mixture than the base fi2000R. i like this unit because you can adjust it manually with simple twists of 3 nob settings. no need to hook anything up to a computer and download anything. you can set it to your liking based on your mods and riding style and conditions, but it does take some trial and error and a few tanks to get it dialed it to where you want it. you can probably pick one up for about $200. other brands out there are more expensive and require you to download specific maps based on your setup and have no way for you to fine tune.

regardless of whether you decide to get the ECU flash mod as others have recommended, the owner even recommends adding a tuner anyway if you have aftermarket air intake and pipes. the ECU flash is not the same as adding a tuner. among the adjustments the ECU flash makes to throttle responses, it changes rev limits and gear and ignition timing, according to the owner. a tuner changes the air/fuel ratio by adding more fuel to your mix. and a manual tuner like the cobra will let you make changes if you decide to change something out at a later date. the ECU flash occurs based on what your current setup is. so if you change your pipes or air later, you will need to get your ECU flashed again. the ECU flash is $350.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
You will pay as much for a tuner as the flash and you will only fix 5% of the problems. With the flash you fix 95% of all the problems the bike has
Many thanks for your advice but the bike has no problems :)...it runs perfectly as it is. I am looking at modifying it.....that is different

However I will never do a flash because a flash is introducing too much of an unknown into the equation. with a fuel tuner I can unplug whenever there is an issue and go back to factory whenever I want to....


r.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
i have the cobra fi2000R O2 model, and it seems to be a popular one. it supposedly gives a more precise mixture than the base fi2000R. i like this unit because you can adjust it manually with simple twists of 3 nob settings. no need to hook anything up to a computer and download anything. you can set it to your liking based on your mods and riding style and conditions, but it does take some trial and error and a few tanks to get it dialed it to where you want it. you can probably pick one up for about $200. other brands out there are more expensive and require you to download specific maps based on your setup and have no way for you to fine tune.

regardless of whether you decide to get the ECU flash mod as others have recommended, the owner even recommends adding a tuner anyway if you have aftermarket air intake and pipes. the ECU flash is not the same as adding a tuner. among the adjustments the ECU flash makes to throttle responses, it changes rev limits and gear and ignition timing, according to the owner. a tuner changes the air/fuel ratio by adding more fuel to your mix. and a manual tuner like the cobra will let you make changes if you decide to change something out at a later date. the ECU flash occurs based on what your current setup is. so if you change your pipes or air later, you will need to get your ECU flashed again. the ECU flash is $350.

Many thanks for your advice and feedback....I will check my options locally in terms of fuel tuner and move accordingly (remember I am in europe)...

One thing which is odd is that an ebay seller of the cobra actually said it is only good for USA models.Power commander actually has a map for european models...is there any known difference in mapping/fueling between the american and european models?

r.
 

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i would assume that US bikes have a different fuel map on the ECU than the Europe models because we have different regulations, but i have no idea if the tuner would not be interchangeable on Europe models. i would suggest you contact Cobra and ask them directly if they are who you want to go with. i've called them up before and they are easy to get hold of.
 

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Hi I am in the UK not long had the same bike as yours, I have put cobra slashdowns on, cobra air intake and the cobra fi2000 for cans without the O2 sensor as the slashdowns didnt have a hole for the sensor and i didnt want to drill it.:surprise: ps if you go down this route you also need a lambda sensor blanking plug
The bike runs great and a whole lot better than standard :laugh::laugh:

Hope this helps if your in the uk see metric cruisers they gave me a hell of a deal on all three if i paid by phone rather then the site or ebay
 

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Discussion Starter #16
i would assume that US bikes have a different fuel map on the ECU than the Europe models because we have different regulations, but i have no idea if the tuner would not be interchangeable on Europe models. i would suggest you contact Cobra and ask them directly if they are who you want to go with. i've called them up before and they are easy to get hold of.
I have sent an email to Cobra in the USA and they have told me that they do not supply anything for non USA bikes since they could not test the products on them...maybe this could be useful imformation for somebody out there..
 

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Discussion Starter #17
Hi I am in the UK not long had the same bike as yours, I have put cobra slashdowns on, cobra air intake and the cobra fi2000 for cans without the O2 sensor as the slashdowns didnt have a hole for the sensor and i didnt want to drill it.:surprise: ps if you go down this route you also need a lambda sensor blanking plug
The bike runs great and a whole lot better than standard :laugh::laugh:

Hope this helps if your in the uk see metric cruisers they gave me a hell of a deal on all three if i paid by phone rather then the site or ebay
Well that is a really good hint:smile::smile:thank you!!
 
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