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Discussion Starter #1
2009 Yamaha Raider s wont start since being ran two days ago. Bike ran briefly only with intermittent throttle but would run for only seconds at idle. The needle sweep on the odometer that normally occurs after the key is turned in the ignition is now sweeping after the key is switched to the off position from the on position. While the bike was running the other day, a faint blackish vapor puffed out with some back fires on initial cold start but cleared after being ran for a few minutes.

Let me know what you guys think could be going on.


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If it were me I'd start with the basics. Change spark plugs, check plug wires, change air filter, oil and oil filter. While you're under the seat check all the hoses, electrical connections and battery.
 

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If it was running fairly normally, and then suddenly quit, then something has dropped out completely:

fuel pump, ignition (spark), or one of the fail safe sensors (like the kickstand)... unless you got some bad gas and sucked a puddle of water into the fuel pump.

the speedometer is now sweeping after the key is switched to the off position from the on position...
if this is not normal then something in your ECM is wacked out.

check the voltage on your battery. If the battery is low, it might have enough to crank the starter, but the voltage might be too low for the ECM to function correctly.

another possibility, if the speedo is only suppose to sweep when the key is turned from off to on, and it does it when you turn the key from on to off, maybe your key switch is intermittent, so when you turn it off, it goes off-on-off-on-off...
 

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Discussion Starter #5
When the key is put into the ignition the fuel pump is audible and I just put premium gas into the bike yesterday while it ran on said fresh gas. However I should mention the bike wasn’t winterized (not a single fluid touched) and is probably due for an oil change. Oil dipstick was almost dry with just a drop at the end of the dipstick. No cracks in the housing of the fuel pump.


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Discussion Starter #6
If it was running fairly normally, and then suddenly quit, then something has dropped out completely:

fuel pump, ignition (spark), or one of the fail safe sensors (like the kickstand)... unless you got some bad gas and sucked a puddle of water into the fuel pump.

if this is not normal then something in your ECM is wacked out.


ECU was just recently reflashed for the bike and I just did IVANS air box delete and K&N air filter.

The previous owner didn’t tell me the quick link for the battery tender was made from remainder wire and solder. Removed and replaced with new quick link and charged battery overnight with tender. Bike won’t start since finding out about dead battery and recharging.


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Discussion Starter #7
If it were me I'd start with the basics. Change spark plugs, check plug wires, change air filter, oil and oil filter. While you're under the seat check all the hoses, electrical connections and battery.


The bike didn’t have an oil change for the winter like I usually do. Ran the bike on the old oil with old gasoline and new premium gasoline mixed with a dab of stabilizer.

Battery quick link was found broken so it never charged for the YEAR that it sat there for. Started just upgrading the airbox and put back my ECU that was reflashed and never updated the map on the PCV. Now bike won’t start and I can’t update the PCV because the bike won’t start.

Battery seems to provide electrical and hold a charge now after charging and fuel pump makes audible noises when the key is turned to ON position in ignition. Added fresh oil to reservoir and nothing.

It almost sounds like the starter motor or something else may have blown.


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Can you put a volt meter on the battery while you are turning the key to the start position?

Lead acid batteries need to be recharged immediately after they are used, or a layer forms on the lead and the battery is then shot. If the bike sat for a whole year, and the battery went completely dead, that could be the issue. If might take a trickle charge and show 12.5V on a meter, but as soon as you hit it with the heavy load of the starter it will go dead.

That could also explain the speedo needle 2 step - if you crank the starter and the battery drops to 3V, when you let off the starter the battery will try to ramp back up- if it makes it back to 10V or more, the ECM will think you just turned the key on, and it will sweep the needle again.

If you dont have a volt meter even the $10 one in the auto section of Walmart is good enough for this purpose - set it to DC Volts (sometimes its V with a flat line _) on a scale higher than 15V.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Can you put a volt meter on the battery while you are turning the key to the start position?



Lead acid batteries need to be recharged immediately after they are used, or a layer forms on the lead and the battery is then shot. If the bike sat for a whole year, and the battery went completely dead, that could be the issue. If might take a trickle charge and show 12.5V on a meter, but as soon as you hit it with the heavy load of the starter it will go dead.



That could also explain the speedo needle 2 step - if you crank the starter and the battery drops to 3V, when you let off the starter the battery will try to ramp back up- if it makes it back to 10V or more, the ECM will think you just turned the key on, and it will sweep the needle again.



If you dont have a volt meter even the $10 one in the auto section of Walmart is good enough for this purpose - set it to DC Volts (sometimes its V with a flat line _) on a scale higher than 15V.


Thanks for the input I don’t have a volt meter but i have been meaning to get one. Guess I just found a reason to get one!

I can’t correct myself now but I should say

*the bike has been sitting for close to a year and I’m sure the previous owner was not aware of the missing connector lead to the positive battery terminal on the quick link for the trickle charger.

That being said maybe it would be easier to replace battery and see where it goes from there?

Just to recap;

Normally, on startup I hear the fuel pump, what I believe is also the starter motor, and can see a needle sweep with relatively bright light on odometer.


Now I’m getting audible fuel pump, NO starter motor sounds and needle sweep only occurs after the key is turned back off not while it’s on.

Hoping to god it’s just the battery


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My second bike is a Suzuki M90. Same boat - had bike in storage over winter. Had the battery hooked up to a trickle charger but when I installed it I got dash power but engine wouldn't crank - clicking. Bought a new battery - started up immediately. Lead acid batteries have to be filled with acid and charged. Maintenance free batteries are hook up and go. That is what I got.
 

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Discussion Starter #12
My second bike is a Suzuki M90. Same boat - had bike in storage over winter. Had the battery hooked up to a trickle charger but when I installed it I got dash power but engine wouldn't crank - clicking. Bought a new battery - started up immediately. Lead acid batteries have to be filled with acid and charged. Maintenance free batteries are hook up and go. That is what I got.


$89.99 lead acid sealed battery at batteries plus

Fml

Any good websites you recommend for maintenance free?





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I just went to a local Battery Plus but your auto store may have one in stock.
 

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Normal led acid battery should never be used in a bike, you have to maintain the water level.

A Sealed lead acid batter can come sealed from the shop, or add the acid yourself, then seal it. I still wouldn't use one in a bike, normally what you use in a car though.

AGM is absorbed gas mat, it keeps the acid from moving around, making the battery flip/tip proof. All of them I know of are sealed. Normally you add the acid yourself then seal it.

GEL is like absorbed gas mat, but uses an acid gel instead. It's charging is slightly different from SLA/AGM batteries. Ibelieve they all come preassembled and sealed.

It a shipping issue to ship the batteries filled with acid, so if you order it online, and most shops you go to, you will get the acid in a bottle and add it yourself. If you get it from a specific battery shop, they normally do this themselves, or have it shipped that way. But USPS/UPS/Fedex won't ship a filled battery.
 

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ECU was just recently reflashed for the bike and I just did IVANS air box delete and K&N air filter.
Hummvee854...Just to address the issue of when you put in Ivan's airbox mod.. did you turn the fuel tank off ?? what else did you disconnect ?? Did you forget something. Might not be a bad idea to retrace what you did putting the airbox mod in..

The battery being dead would for sure give some issues but did the issue start after doing the Ivan airbox mod ??
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Hummvee854...Just to address the issue of when you put in Ivan's airbox mod.. did you turn the fuel tank off ?? what else did you disconnect ?? Did you forget something. Might not be a bad idea to retrace what you did putting the airbox mod in..



The battery being dead would for sure give some issues but did the issue start after doing the Ivan airbox mod ??


The issue did begin after the Airbox mod.

I followed the steps for turning the fuel off and on for gas tank removal from service manual but I never removed the hoses only pushed the gas tank aside to remove the air-box and drop the filter in. Repeated steps backwards and double checked the lines were all patent. The only other issue was removing the LEDS the previous owner hot glued to the frame, gas tank, and fenders. He soldered all of the LEDS wiring together and wrapped the solder points in electrical tape before tucking it with other cables going to the battery. I think the stacked cables may have broke off some of the connectors

Other than that I removed a sticker from the windshield.





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I'm just asking because I pulled the tank off to install a FMS and after all was said and done I went for a ride and about 40km in the bike stalled.. I had forgotten to turn the fuel back on since it's underneath and not visible I couldn't do it while seated on the bike.

There are Electrical connections to the tank that feed the Speedo assembly.. could you have stretched or disconnected them when you moved the tank aside ??

That would explain the weird speedo behaviour and maybe the starting/running issue if the ECU is looking for a proper input.

Also looking at Ivan's picture..there are quite a few electrical connectors above the filter and that hose.. what is that hose for ?? a breather ??

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I'm just asking because I pulled the tank off to install a FMS and after all was said and done I went for a ride and about 40km in the bike stalled.. I had forgotten to turn the fuel back on since it's underneath and not visible I couldn't do it while seated on the bike.



There are Electrical connections to the tank that feed the Speedo assembly.. could you have stretched or disconnected them when you moved the tank aside ??



That would explain the weird speedo behaviour and maybe the starting/running issue if the ECU is looking for a proper input.


Hmm good idea will triple check the speedo connections and fuel lines when I get the battery in a few hours today and try it out.


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