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one question, at what speed does lane splitting become illegal ? most drivers don't mind a bike rolling by them in congested traffic but when they fly by that's what gets people upset, it all in how you do it, i mean is weaving in and out of traffic really lane splitting. especially if traffic is rolling at half the speed limit say 35mph, you can't convince me it's safe
legal and safe are not always the same thing. I take safe over legal.

Traffic rarely moves at a constant pace, on my commute it can go from stopped to 45 then back down to 20, then up to 30, then down to 5... etc. It is a constant ebb and flow. Thus I "try" to stay around 15mph differential, but really I am speeding up and slowing down with the traffic to keep my differential speed as safe as possible.

If traffic is going 65 and I am moving faster than traffic at 70 or 75, my differential is still only 5-10mph, which is very safe in comparison to someone who's differential is 25-35mph.

I need to make sure that I can react to the traffic around me and never be moving faster than cars can logically see me if they use their mirrors before changing lanes.

Here is a perfect example of my safe lane splitting speed and that of an unsafe rider:
https://youtu.be/aZqBChcDjpo

Differential speed is the only speed that matters when it comes to safer lane splitting.
 

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I have watched that video before. I have read Klurejr's blog he posted. This video is one example of where I slightly disagree with lane splitting. While Klurejr was not unsafe in his speed, which looked to about 60is while the cars were probably doing 50 -55. I do not think I would be splitting if traffic is flowing. Then again, is it more safe to split or lane to lane to pass? Which one is more of a "dick move" according to other posters? I think if traffic is flowing I would flow with it, stopped or nearly stopped I would lane split my butt off. Then again it is illegal here so I do not do it on a regular basis to feel comfortable with it. If there are no cops around I will filter to the front in a heart beat. IF someone gets upset about it I am gone before they can even take their foot off the brake. BTW you were hauling butt from 4:04-4:38 in that video.. :p
 

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Then again, is it more safe to split or lane to lane to pass?
Really depends on the situation, I don't have a blanket answer for that as I am constantly changing what I am doing to stay safe within the traffic flow. Observing other drivers and how well they are or are not paying attention plays into my decision process. If a guy is on his phone and swerving around, I hold back and wait for a better gap to move into another lane and get past him.... Just one example.
Which one is more of a "dick move" according to other posters?
Other posters who do not live in California need not respond as the views and feelings on the subject are going to be skewed by the fact that they do not experience it being done in a legal fashion everyday.

I am certain my opinion of lane splitting would be different if I grew up and learned to ride in a place where it is not legal.

I have some footage of me lane spitting "at speed" past a few CHP, they even moved over to give me more room. If I did that in Texas I would get a ticket. Everyone needs to remember the discussion about lane splitting is for places it is legal, which is California and the rest of the world, not the other 49 states (for now).
 

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You know I am all for lane splitting and filtering. I did not grow up or spend a lot of time in California. I just know traffic in ANY city that does not have the infrastructure to handle it SUCKS.. This link was posted in another thread. Makes all the points you make if not more from someone in Texas. CLICKY
 

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You know I am all for lane splitting and filtering. I did not grow up or spend a lot of time in California. I just know traffic in ANY city that does not have the infrastructure to handle it SUCKS.. This link was posted in another thread. Makes all the points you make if not more from someone in Texas. CLICKY
I posted that link in the other thread.. lol.

I do think some users here might be mis-reading my statements when I speak about lane splitting and such, but I am speaking from experience in California, not in Texas or Virginia or any other state I have not been to on a regular basis. I am not saying here that every other state must accept my views, obviously each state is different. Though the trend is leaning towards allowing splitting/sharing/filtering in one way or another in some states.
 

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I am not misreading, I do not think. It is not a selfish thing to lane split, it is not meant to be special, it should just be a part of traffic. Like Motorcycles allowed in carpool lanes. No one is crying about that.
 

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...but I am speaking from experience in California, not in Texas or Virginia or any other state I have not been to on a regular basis.
Very relevant. One of the things that has to be considered is the familiarity of -car- drivers with lane-splitting, its purpose & legality. That's one thing that sets California apart from states where it isn't legal (or where it hasn't been legal for an extended time).
 

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... Like Motorcycles allowed in carpool lanes. No one is crying about that.
'Lane' is the operative word there.... not 'car', 'pool' or 'motorcycle'. If there's enough space for a car to split lanes, should it be allowed to? When a car travels in a breakdown lane or in a median to pass traffic, is that an admirable thing to do because that driver is reducing traffic congestion?
 

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'Lane' is the operative word there.... not 'car', 'pool' or 'motorcycle'. If there's enough space for a car to split lanes, should it be allowed to? When a car travels in a breakdown lane or in a median to pass traffic, is that an admirable thing to do because that driver is reducing traffic congestion?
Now you are talking about something against the law. Not the same. In Cali it is LEGAL for a MC to lane split. The argument earlier was why should a motorcycle be special and get to lane split. Well they also get to ride in the carpool lane even with just a rider. That makes them special and able to pass traffic and get in front of the ones stuck in traffic. What is the difference?
 

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Now you are talking about something against the law. Not the same.
Lane splitting is against the law in most states where people still split lanes and try to justify their actions by saying they're helping cut down on traffic congestion.


In Cali it is LEGAL for a MC to lane split.
Yes it is, that doesn't make it 'right' or safe, it only makes it legal but I guess we'll see how that pans out. I'm really curious to see what the legal outcome will be when a lane splitting motorcyclist collides with a vehicle that is rightfully in it's own lane.


The argument earlier was why should a motorcycle be special and get to lane split. Well they also get to ride in the carpool lane even with just a rider. That makes them special and able to pass traffic and get in front of the ones stuck in traffic. What is the difference?
The difference is that it's a lane. The motorcycle and car have to stay within a certain space designated by lines and there is no cross over of traffic. Lane splitting disregards the whole concept of 'lanes' or lines designating them which is a major factor governing our traffic laws. Surely I didn't have to point that out to you and once again repeat myself.
 

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Lane splitting is against the law in most states where people still split lanes and try to justify their actions by saying they're helping cut down on traffic congestion.
You are correct and it will.


Yes it is, that doesn't make it 'right' or safe, it only makes it legal but I guess we'll see how that pans out. I'm really curious to see what the legal outcome will be when a lane splitting motorcyclist collides with a vehicle that is rightfully in it's own lane.
Since they have been doing it for years without a ton of major mishaps looks like it is working very well.


The difference is that it's a lane. The motorcycle and car have to stay within a certain space designated by lines and there is no cross over of traffic. Lane splitting disregards the whole concept of 'lanes' or lines designating them which is a major factor governing our traffic laws. Surely I didn't have to point that out to you.
NO
The argument was that the motorcycles were getting a special privilege by being allowed to lane split. That the motorcycles were being dicks for going to the front. The carpool lane allows the same thing.. so what is the difference? AGAIN AND AGAIN I say, if you do not want to lane split or filter then don't. Sit behind the stinking ass cars breathe in the exhaust.
 

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Just a side note, I needed to drive my truck to work yesterday to drop my wife off at the airport, Left around 3:12pm from a location that is a few miles closer to home than my regular office, took me until 4:30 to get home. If I was on the bike yesterday I would of been home by 3:50 or 3:55.
 

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Discussion Starter #73
Got myself in a potentially fatally dangerous situation yesterday.

Was riding on 2 lane back roads, and had to get on a main 2 lane road to cross over a bridge, then turn left onto another back road.

There was nothing coming that I could see when I pulled out onto the main road. As soon as I was getting upto 55mph I saw a big truck in my mirror coming up fast behind me - doing 65 to 70.

I sped up and got over the bridge, looked like I had time to make the left turn infront of on coming traffic, but as I was slowing down I could see they were coming too fast, at least 65.. a couple cars and another 18 wheeler behind them.

I had to stop in the left side of the only lane. There was a big paved shoulder on the right. The truck coming up behind me moved onto the shoulder and blew past without slowing down, about the same time as the traffic coming the other way passed me at speed on the left.

For me to stop in the middle of my lane and force the truck behind me to stop might not have ended well.

In hindsight, when I realized I did not have time to make the turn without stopping I should have kept going straight. Making left turns in fast heavy traffic is probably the most dangerous thing you can do on a motorcycle.
 

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Whew! Scary, man!

You're right, not turning would've been the best option but it's understandable why you did what you did. You already had it in your head you were making that turn and you didn't have a lot of time to react to the oncoming traffic. You did the next best thing though by not stopping in the middle of the lane and luckily that driver had the sense to move over. He had to make a split second decision too. Yeah, he shouldn't have been going that fast, but it's not easy to slow one of those things down quickly and sometimes it's best not to touch the brakes. If he had and his trailer brakes locked up and it kicked out sideways... well, it might not have turned out so good.

Anyway, glad you're ok (I have my doubts about the condition of your underwear though!)
 
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I will normally whole heartedly blame the cages for the stupid actions they take when they knowingly or unknowingly endanger us on 2 (or 3) wheels. Today, however, was definitely caused by what should be considered brethren.
Easing down the HOV lane this morning, a nice easy 70ish, had the lane all to myself for as far as I could see ahead. Group of at least 6 bikes of mixed make came on to the interstate and saw my enjoyment and decided to cross the other 3 fairly full lanes post haste. Now, this would have only been mildly irritating if they hadn't spooked traffic with their abrupt group movement. This caused the car that was in the lane to my right and a few feet in front of me to freak and decide they also wanted to be in that nice clear lane I was in. However they decided to occupy the same spot I was in the process of filling. They were considerate enough to give me about a blink or two notice, at which I commenced pressing my horn button almost through the handlebar. Without time to brake hard or try a high speed evasive, I took to the full size paved shoulder. In my frustration, I did take the time to make sure I hit their mirror with my hand on passing. I was able to get around the car and back in the lane just in time for the rear bike to cut a few feet in front of me. Needless to say I was not pleased with the actions of the group, who were proudly displaying patches on several of their vests. Now, I don't know if they realized what they had almost caused or not, but they were definitely trying to put distance between the incident and themselves, which is a bit tricky with me on a Raider. When I closed the gap and came around in front of them, they quickly dropped from 80 ish to 60 and fell back. Not an apology wave, greeting wave or anything in the process.
While I can only defend my actions with saying heat of the moment, I feel this both falls in to the theme of the thread and shows there are riders out there that are giving the all the others bad reputations (myself hopefully excluded from the first group still)
Be safe out there...there's dangerous people on every wheel combination.
 

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I think I have a unique perspective on lane splitting from 1989 to 2002 I commuted from Venice to Pacoima Ca. About 27 miles in a car on a good day it was a 2 hr drive on a bike you could cut it down to an hour riding safely. This commute changed me, I went from a laid back cruiser to blowing my horn at bikes that were splitting to slow got hit and it changed my perspective and my life. I still lane split but only when cars are stopped and will do no more than 10 or 15 mph.
 

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I think I have a unique perspective on lane splitting from 1989 to 2002 I commuted from Venice to Pacoima Ca. About 27 miles in a car on a good day it was a 2 hr drive on a bike you could cut it down to an hour riding safely. This commute changed me, I went from a laid back cruiser to blowing my horn at bikes that were splitting to slow got hit and it changed my perspective and my life. I still lane split but only when cars are stopped and will do no more than 10 or 15 mph.
Although illegal in Florida, I will filter to the front when cars are stopped like that. I have split 2 cars going down the road but that is a very rare thing. Usually it is 2 cars that have been side by side running under the speed limit and holding up a bunch of traffic for whatever reason they think is good.
 

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Discussion Starter #79 (Edited)
AlphaOmega - was thinking about your close encounter while riding in this morning.

That is a good example of a common situation - drivers can usually only handle one issue - when more than one thing is going on they get overloaded and make things worse.

It sounds like both you and the driver saw the pack of bikers cutting across lanes. The driver thought he should get out of the way, he did hit his blinker. You might have been in his blind spot, or maybe he just did not look.

Since I got my license 5 years ago I am becoming more aware of situations that might put me in a bad position before they happen. I do this in my car too, and when my wife is with me she actually gets upset because I am being cautious and driving defensively.

For example: if Im going down the street and a I see a car approaching on a cross street at an intersection, or coming out of a driveway, I immediately recognize that car might not stop. If they are not slowing down normally, to stop behind the white line, I let off the gas and cover the brake. If they are approaching fast I start slowing down, because all I see now is a car with a heading and velocity that IS on a collision course, and I dont know what the driver is going to do.

This is where my wife gets upset "WHAT are you doing?! WHY are you slowing down?! He HAS TO stop! He has a stop sign! You have the right of way!..."

I tried to explain it to her several times - he does NOT have to stop - painted signs have no magical power to stop a 4000 lb car - and 200,000 cars end up getting totally in the US every year and 40,000 people get killed because someone did NOT "have to" stop when they were suppose to.

She tells me "you are not on your motorcycle - you dont have to be so careful" as if its ok to Tbone someone in your car, if you could see it coming and avoid it.

I have been in a similar situation as what happened to you - I saw a car merge onto the highway while I was behind an 18 wheeler that was in the left lane. The car merged in the trucks blind spot all the way into the right lane, the truck put his blinker on and moved over right into the side of the car. The car turned left 90° and got 3/4rd by the front of the truck, which spun the car the other way, and it went off on the shoulder....

THAT was about the time I realized Im behind all this an maybe I should slow down..... I was so stunned I was about 4 seconds from joining the party.

The thing I took away from that, I could see it coming all the way from when the car first pulled onto the merge lane: he's in that trucks blind spot....blind spot....blind spot....blind spot....blind spot....blind spot.... WHAM!
 

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I encounter idiots every day on my commute. I have to drive on I-40 and there is a part of I-40 where cars merge on the right and then it splits into I-40 and I-85 bus on the left and cars try to make it to the left lane which makes it very bad considering all those sleepy zombies on their phones not bothering to check mirrors/blind spots and/or using blinkers. That part of I-40 is called the Death Valley.

People just forgot that driving is a privilege and not their default right. IMO, DMV should really be conducting IQ test prior to written/driving test.
 
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